From: Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion Subject: Re: Drummer Injuries - Info & request for input . .. Date: 5 Jun 1996 08:56:45 GMT I'm just an amateur drummer, but I've found that drumming has actually helped with wrist pain. I type a lot, and a while back, I was having regular twinges in my left wrist after extended periods at the keyboard. But I just about doubled my practicing frequency a few months ago, and I believe that the resulting strengthening of my wrists has given me more endurance, and has made it easier to hold my hands in a good position when typing. I bet I'm atypical, though, because I tend to play very relaxed, and I am careful to pivot the sticks on my fingers and allow my fingers to absorb most of the shock--which seems to be the opposite of the advice I've seen on the group about building speed and power. (Oh, well.) From: Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion Subject: drummer injuries Date: Fri, 7 Jun 1996 16:28:36 -0500 I suffered (suffer) from what I would call over-use syndrome. I went to all sorts of specialists and no one really helped me and some even just said "well you'll never play again. get over it". I finally went to see a "musical arts doctor" in Chicago and she gave me warm-up and cool-down exercises that I still do years later. I find if I don't do them I can't play for very long without the pain coming back. I'm a concert percussionist and I had to learn how to play four-mallets all over again and basically had to change my entire approach to practicing. The good news is I'm still playing and have a much more relaxed approach. If anyone is interested in this "doctor" in Chicago or the exercises, send me an email. Andrea From: To: < Subject: Re: drum ouchies Date: Wed, 12 Jun 1996 08:06:53 -0500 Actually I have altered the kit and my playing habits just a little. I've lightened up on my hits quite a bit. As a consequence, I've moved to a lighter cymbal overall and I've tuned the kit just a little different. I've also started experimenting with different stick weights and densities. The only other change I've made is my drum and cymbal position. Going through the physical therapy and such taught me a great deal about how the muscles and tendons operate in the hand, wrist, and elbows. I've started positioning the drums and cymbals to complement natural human movement. I haven't settled on any one setup (making my memory locks obsolete for now), but I'm getting close and I can feel the difference already. Keep up the great work! --------- From: To: < Greetings! I found your WWW site from a Usenet post. I think what you're doing is GREAT! I've been a drummer for nearly 10 years now and I'm an IS consultant. Thousands of hours of playing everything from speed metal to mellow jazz coupled with thousands of hours of heavy computer use have led to tendinitis and arthritis in my hands, wrists, knees, and feet. Probably the best advice I could probably give any player is to a) watch your playing habits, b) do plenty of warm up AND cool down excercises before and after playing, and c) if you're in doubt... see a professional! I can't over-stress that last one. While your town may not have a music related injury specialist, chances are there's a sports therapist nearby. If you let things go too far you'll end up in surgery and eventually physical therapy. Neither of these is very fun (trust me) and there's NOTHING in the world worth the pain of critical muscle reconstruction therapy. Some common symptoms are: 1. Aching pain in the hands and elbows 2. Numbness in the hands or feet 3. Extreme fatigue after only a short time of playing I played for over 5 years and ignored these symptoms (partially out of denial and partially out of ignorance). I often ate 5-10 Tylenol before playing and eventually resorted to stronger pain killers just to play for more than 1/2 hour. This is NOT normal. Just because you feel tired or "worn-out" during a session does NOT mean you're simply "out of shape" or "not conditioned". Do not ignore these warning signs! You're much better off asking a qualified therapist if there could be a problem than simply ignoring it. Finally, don't try to fix the problem yourself. If you find that asprin or other pain killers are the only way you're able to play then something's probaby wrong. Don't assume your occasional stretch routine is sufficent. Most of us use a drum tech to get the most out of our kit and we should ALL use a therapist to keep our bodies in the same condition. Greg gma PS: Rock hard and rock long, but don't kill yourself doing it! -- Eagles may fly high, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines! Subject: Re: Hurtin' drummer . . . . Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion > Greetings, > > I am a 24 year old drummer from Ottawa having played over > eighteen years. I have played in many bands of styles ranging from > rock to blues, funk and now African music. > > Over the past five or six years I developed serious hand problems > which I can't fix. The problems began as some mild tendonitis > mainly in my right elbow. This never really became too serious. > Eventually I tried to fix this problem by changing my grip on the > sticks very slightly, by trying to keep a space between my thumb > and pointer finger. This seemed to alleviate the tendonitis to > some degree, however, I began to develop shock when hitting the > drums, which seemed to have caused a tightness and callusing in > the palm of my hand. I think this callusing was caused by the > swelling of my tendons and the movement of my fingers. > > I kept playing in bands regularly even though I had this problem. > Eventually my right hand began to swell mildly and has been this > way for more than two years. I have also developed a straining of > my forearm muscles which I think has caused my muscles to > contract when I try to relax. I find it very difficult to play > and not tense my muscles. The straining and tension have also > developed in almost every part of my body. I have also felt a > numbness in my hands and arms which I think is caused from the > locking and tensing of my forearm muscles and therefore not > letting the blood flow through properly. I have also developed a > ganglion in my right wrist which comes and goes. > > At this point I am physically and mentally at the end of my rope. > I have talked to some drummers in the area to no avail. I've also > seen many medical doctors about this problem, including a > physiotherapist at the Hamilton Performing Arts Health Clinic, > however, this has proven useless. My strength seems to be all > right and my technical ability has never really been affected too > much by this problem. > > I have discovered a few things which seem to help alleviate the > symptoms to a certain degree. I have found that when I stand up > facing my drums from the logo side of the bass drum and raise my > arm up and extend my forearm and hit the toms at that angle the > shock seems to go away and the tension in my arms tends to lessen > a little bit as well. The numbness in my hands also dissipates a > little. Doing this almost immediately reverses the symptoms to > some degree. However, this only lasts for about a half an hour or > so. I also wear thick gloves to help with the shock when hitting > the drum. This helps sometimes, but hasn't really fixed the > problem. > > I am in desperate need of a solution to my problem and would > appreciate any suggestions you may have, or if you know of anyone > who might be able to help. I have run out of ways and ideas as to > what is wrong and how to fix it. You can contact me by phone, > mail or email. > > Thanks for your anticipated help - > RE: Drummer injury: I have great empathy for you, or your friend rather. I went through a similar, somewhat more mild condition a few years ago. After much physical and mental anguish, here is what I've learned: There was only one thing to do, and deep down inside, I knew it all along. I had to stop playing all together and think about what was causing all this pain, and how it could be avoided. The problem, for me and from what you say, you as well, is the grip/stroke/reflex being way to tense and tight. I know this sounds overly simplistic, but it may be the root of all evil. I used to lay in bed and imagine stroking the drum, loosely, relaxed, without muscular tension. After about a month of serious mental re-enactment, I sat down with a pad and pair of sticks. You know what comes next: teach yourself how to hold the sticks and stroke the pad without tension, without "force", and with only natural movements. Let the sticks play themselves. Make it feel good and natural, the very first sign of tension or pain, STOP. Close your eyes and figure out what went wrong. Progress till you are sitting behind a set of drums with your eyes closed, playing grooves with a pinpoint fulcrum, but "rubbery" muscles and loose skeleton. For me, the key was really paying close attention to my body, what it was telling me and ignoring everything else. It is a couple of years later for me, and now all I think of when I play is playing. It might take some time, and some sacrifice and patience, but it will be worth it. Hope this helps, let me know what you think. sc Newsgroups: rec.music.makers.percussion (mrspeed) writes: >Where should my thumb be when I'm using a regular (non-military) >grip? Should it be parralel or should it barely be touching the >stick? It seems like when I hold it parralel my thumb cramps up, even >when I loosen my grip. Any Help > >MR SPEED My thumb is even with my indexfinger on each hand. Not up past the index finger nor behind the index finger. This provides the proper fulcrum point for the stick to pivot up and down freely in my hand using my other 3 fingers to control the stick. That fulcrum point you are making with the thumb and index finger doesn't need to held tightly. Let the stick float inbetween those two fingers and keep the other 3 fingers loosely touching the stick. That stick won't come out of your hand even though it may feel like it. I learned my lesson on how to properly hold the sticks the hard way about 3 years ago. A rock band called me to set in for them while their regular drummer got married and went on his honeymoon. They told me, "The louder you play the better." I was a little tense having not played nor rehersing with them before hand. So got up there and held the sticks as tight as I could and banged my brains out the first night. I hand blisters on both thumbs, both index fingers, and both middle fingers and I had 11 nights to go yet. So I learned real quick how to keep a nice relaxed grip and still perform as I was expected to. I hope I was of some help.